How to avoid being Steven Bartlett's Diary of a CEO
Authenticity in podcasting is all the rage these days, but let’s be real—most of the folks shouting about it don’t even know what they’re talking about.
Let's learn what trust really means in this wild audio podcasting jungle, and spoiler alert: it’s not about slapping out unedited recordings like some sort of lazy podcasting buffet.
We’ll also throw some shade at the likes of Steven Bartlett, whose antics might just be the poster child for everything that’s gone wrong with podcasting trust.
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Steven Bartlett
- Diary of a CEO
- Dr. Joe Dispenza
- Podmastery.co
- Spotify
- Advertising Standards Authority
- Podknows
Mentioned in this episode:
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Transcript
You've probably heard everyone banging on about authenticity in podcasting, but the people shouting it the loudest don't actually know what it means.
Speaker A:They're usually referring to hands off editing.
Speaker A:In other words, if it happened in the recording, it gets published in the final episode, something that I would call lazy editing.
Speaker A:So let's talk about what authenticity, and more importantly, trust, is really about.
Speaker A:And warning.
Speaker A:No real life Stephen Bartletts were harmed in the making of this episode.
Speaker A:Podmaster welcome to Podcasting Insights with the Podmaster.
Speaker A:I'm Neil Velio, the self appointed aforementioned podmaster, and I give myself that title because I've been hosting, producing and consulting with podcasts like yours for more than 20 years.
Speaker A:I've seen what works, I've seen what really doesn't work, and now I mostly spend my time helping other podcasters like you to also enjoy success with their podcasts, particularly if they've been underperforming up until now.
Speaker A:If you want to know more about how I can help podcasters just like you, head to Podmastery Co and click book a chat with Neil in the menu mentioning that you clicked after listening to this podcast.
Speaker A:We've all got podcasters we admire for what, whatever reason.
Speaker A:Some because of their style, some because of their ability to grow a massive audience, some simply because they have the budget for that dream microphone that we've been desperately asking Santa for every Christmas and never get pleasantly surprised.
Speaker A:But what if your podcast hero isn't as trustworthy as you thought?
Speaker A:You know, trust isn't just some marketing buzzword.
Speaker A:It's the very foundation of of podcasting.
Speaker A:It's what sets us apart from the other media.
Speaker A:Radio, television and other mediums have all had their run ins with the authorities over the years for everything from lying to listeners through treating contestants with contempt all the way through to lying about how many people are calling in to competition lines and how much the prize value was.
Speaker A:None of this helps build trust with an audience, and if you lose that trust, you're toast.
Speaker A:So in this episode I wanted to take a look into what genuine trust looks and sounds like.
Speaker A:And spoiler alert.
Speaker A:Stephen Bartlett might just be everything that is wrong with podcasting.
Speaker A:So let's get into it.
Speaker B:Chapter 1 Trust vs.
Speaker B:BS in podcasting.
Speaker A:Podcasting is not radio.
Speaker A:There are a lot of similarities.
Speaker A:I mean, both are mostly considered to be audio, although obviously there is a big conversation around that going on at the moment.
Speaker A:What I can say with absolute certainty is for the most part, most podcasters are not big institutions with paid professionals working for them who have to approach accountability with fact checking, it's usually just the podcaster, their microphone, and their listener's faith in what they're hearing.
Speaker A:So if you break that faith, they'll ditch you quicker than Spotify ditched Prince Harry's podcast.
Speaker A:Ouch.
Speaker A:So what's the fine line between real authenticity and irresponsible nonsense?
Speaker A:It's simple.
Speaker A:Authenticity is not airing all your dirty laundry.
Speaker A:It's about respect, integrity, and being reliably truthful, at least to the very best of your knowledge.
Speaker A:You're not always going to get it right, but if you're not going in with the intention to get it right from the beginning, you're never going to get it right.
Speaker A:So screw that up and you deserve every lost follower your podcast ends up without.
Speaker B:Stephen Bartlett, Poster child for broken trust in podcasting.
Speaker A:Speaking of screwing up, then, let's talk about Steven Bartlett for just a moment.
Speaker A:His podcast, Diary of a CEO isn't exactly short of listeners, at least now it's not always been the case, but recently he's dropped a couple of clangers that have meant his followers have stopped listening in droves, and that should have him sweating.
Speaker A:The reason?
Speaker A:Well, Bartlett's allowed guests to run wild with dangerous claims.
Speaker A:Everything from cancer, curing keto diets, autism and ADHD diagnosis triggers, anti vax conspiracies, you name it, with barely a challenge to his guests that are spouting their unsubstantiated nonsense.
Speaker A:And those few times where he does have a guest with integrity, his interview with them is so boring it sends most listeners to sleep and flies under the radar.
Speaker A:Doesn't get talked about.
Speaker A:Take the Dr.
Speaker A:Joe Dispenza interview for an example.
Speaker A:Now, I personally love the work of Dr.
Speaker A:Joe Dispenza.
Speaker A:I will go and seek out any content from Dr.
Speaker A:Joe Dispenza that I can find.
Speaker A:I got about 10 minutes into the diary of a CEO episode with Dr.
Speaker A:Joe Dispenza before I just reached for my phone and started mindlessly scrolling, because that was way more entertaining than the questions I was seeing being asked on screen.
Speaker A:And if you want to know why I was watching it rather than listening to it, it was all part of some wider research I was doing about video versus audio, which will surface in a future episode of this podcast.
Speaker A:Back to my point, Bartlett has already been slapped by the Advertising Standards Authority for pushing nutrition products without mentioning that he's personally cashing in each time.
Speaker A:This isn't trust building.
Speaker A:This is exactly the kind of dodgy podcasting that ruins the game for the rest of us.
Speaker A:And that's why I get so angry with Steven Bartlett.
Speaker A:It's not just a personality clash.
Speaker B:Chapter three how not to Screw Up Like Steven Bartlett.
Speaker A:So you want to know how to avoid a Steven Bartlett style PR nightmare?
Speaker A:Okay, it's easy.
Speaker A:I'll run you through it right now.
Speaker A:Four Steps Step one Fact Check if your podcast guest is making outrageous claims, don't just quietly nod along like a puppet, challenge them, verify their claim, or edit it out completely.
Speaker A:Your listeners deserve better than being misled just because your guest is kind of a big deal.
Speaker A:Step two Consistency.
Speaker A:And we're not talking about release cadence here.
Speaker A:I mean consistency in ethical standards.
Speaker A:Don't flip flop between authentic insight and snake oil sales pitches.
Speaker A:Pick a lane and stick with it.
Speaker A:Otherwise your audience, like Stephen Bartlett's, are just left completely confused and it leads to polarization amid your audience.
Speaker A:Step 3 Listener engagement isn't just for likes and comments.
Speaker A:It's actually about listening to your audience.
Speaker A:If they tell you that you're going off the rails, guess what?
Speaker A:You probably are.
Speaker A:And that leads us to step four, perhaps the most important.
Speaker A:In fact, be brutally transparent about your sponsors, interests and affiliations.
Speaker A:Nothing tanks trust quicker than hidden agendas.
Speaker A:If your audience are telling you that since you made changes to mentioning your affiliates every single episode and those affiliates are known to be scammers, best to disclose that truth.
Speaker A:Remember, it should always be more important that you have your listener's trust on side than a thousand extra dollars in your bank account that really comes from blood money.
Speaker B:Chapter 4 Practical Tips to Be a Trusted Podcaster.
Speaker A:All right, so let's get specific with this then.
Speaker A:When we're talking about tips for being trustworthy, here's the deal.
Speaker A:If you're talking health, finance, or anything life critical, invite only experts, not grifters.
Speaker A:Make the effort to spend some extra time on research and always, always clearly label your sponsored content.
Speaker A:And don't think that popping a quick mention at the end of the episode is gonna suffice.
Speaker A:It won't.
Speaker A:That is some shady crap.
Speaker A:You know as well as I do how many of your listeners are hanging around until after the outro.
Speaker A:Don't hide the truth amid the silence and back to the whole listeners telling you what they wanna hear thing.
Speaker A:Encourage and act on that listener feedback, even if it stings.
Speaker A:There's no room for ego here.
Speaker A:Trust isn't built on ignoring criticism.
Speaker A:It grows when listeners see and hear that you care enough to improve.
Speaker A:Don't act like a LinkedIn influencer who ignores all the negative comments and only addresses the ones that make them look good.
Speaker A:Act like a serious business leader who wants to grow a wholesome following of like minded individuals.
Speaker A:Build a genuinely informed community around your podcast.
Speaker A:One where misinformation can't take root because everyone's too switched on and kills it on the spot.
Speaker B:Chapter 5 Next Steps.
Speaker A:Look, the bottom line is that trust isn't just an essential part of your podcasting journey, it is pretty much the whole shebang.
Speaker A:So take an honest listen to your podcast.
Speaker A:Are you authentic, responsible and transparent or are you inching dangerously close to Stephen Bartlett territory?
Speaker A:And it's not just Stephen Bartlett.
Speaker A:Stephen Bartlett has, for some bizarre reason seemingly become the model podcast that all interview shaped podcasts want to follow.
Speaker A:Listen to pretty much any podcast in the business section and you will hear a clone of Diary of a CEO just with different hosts and different guests.
Speaker A:How many of those are keeping it real, honest and accountable?
Speaker A:If I had to take a guess, I'd say fewer than 5%.
Speaker A:If you found this episode insightful, share it with another podcaster who you think would also find it useful and help to keep podcasting ethical.
Speaker A:Look out for the next episode of Podcasting Insights with the Podmaster in your library.
Speaker A:And well done for joining us and taking yet another step towards attaining podmastery.
Speaker B:The Podmaster is a pod nose production.
Speaker B:Find out more about us at Podnos Co uk.
Speaker B:Podnos.
